Although Mother Kilwinning Number 0 claim to be the oldest lodge in the world – their early records were lost in fires and other disasters and now only have records dating to the middle of the 15th Century.

Lodge Edinburgh Mary’s Chapel claim to being the oldest lodge reflects only the fact that it can produce consecutive minutes for the Lodge from the 1599 Schaw Statutes as noted in the article.
It is in fact impossible to determine who is the oldest lodge as records from middle 15th Century and earlier are rare or lost to time. If as Kilwinning claims it’s history stems from the building of the associated Abbey, then the Lodge of Melrose St John lays equal claim to being the oldest lodge in the world as the Abbey was consecrated in 1136 which is 4 years before Kilwinning.
The resaon Kilwinning holds Number 0 on the roll of Grand Lodge is that they fell out with what became a very Edinburgh centric organisation in its early days and therefore left the amity of the union of Lodges for a period of 80 years, eventually reconcilling themselves with Grand Lodge on the basis that as they had acted as a Mother Lodge and issued charters to their own daughter lodges they would not be beholden to the list of lodges asa daughter lodge but insisted on being referred to as a Mother Lodge and in recognition of the same Schaw Statutes, Kilwinning was noted by Schaw as being the “heid ludge”; Grand Lodge accepted the proposal to then list them at the head of their roll and because Edinburgh already carried No1 they could only give Kilwinning No0.
In the same manner, Melrose held out as an independant Grand Lodge until 1891 when agreement was finally reached to bring Melrose into the fold of Grand Lodge. There is ample evidence to proove Melrose existed as alodge well before Edinburgh’s date of 1599, especially as the Abbey has Masons marks in the stones of it’s fabric, there existed a lodge meeting house which was rebuilt in 1613 and a gravestone to Andrew Mein a Mason of Newstead who died aged 65 in 1624 which without a great deal of clever mathmatics would clearly show the lodge was active as early as 1575 and even prior to that if was to be have been made an Enterred Apprentice. In fact his ancestor Petrus de Mein was associated with the early building of the Abbey. Also John Morrow (or Murdo) was the master of works in the rebuilding of the Abbey in 1385 and there inscriptions in the stone of the building dedicated by him to the Abbey. It is historically known that he was also responsible for Glasgow, St Andrews and other eclesiastical building erected throughout the lated 14th and early 15th Centuries.
In joining Grand Lodge , this august body accepted that Melrose was indeed a claimant to being both an ancient Lodge and possibly the oldest Lodge, however as it now had Kilwinning as No0 and Edinburgh as No1 it could not usurp these positions of Lodges that where involved in the original setting up of Grand Lodge itself and so allocated Melrose the unusual numbering of No1bis
which is properly written as 1 with a raised 2 (bis being the latin for 2).
Readers are encouraged to look at our website to view the history of the Lodge but please remember that without the full written eveidence of when a Lodge
was formed and consecrated no one Lodge can properly justify claiming to be the undisputed oldest Lodge in either Scotlan or the World.

Wonderful information. Would it be possible for you to send me a copy of those first minutes? If so, I would be eternally grateful.

Thank you so very much.

Sincerely and fraternally,

Carl Byerly
PM Pisgah 32, Coryson, Indiana

I have really enjoyed this site. Would it be possible to send me a copy of those July 31, 1599 minutes? Thank you.

Carl Byerly, PM,
2625 German Ridge Road NE
Corydon IN 47112-7405
(812) 366-3333

excellent info, would be obliged if you could send me a copy of the minutes dated 31st July 1599 for a educational piece

thank you